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Tony, you're on Wikipedia :-) (Read 14996 times)
kheider
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Tony, you're on Wikipedia :-)
01/29/09 at 00:52:16
 
Well ok, it's GravSim that is on Wikipedia. Smiley
 
My GravSim skills are merely functional, but I did upload an image showing "The motion of Orcus relative to a rotating frame of Neptune's average semi-major axis. Plotted from 2009 to 11775 with a time step of 1.5 days on a scale of 126 AU."  It's a start.  Any suggestions on a better way to word it?
 
Would it be better to say: "relative to a rotating frame of Neptune's average orbital period"?
Or should I get wordy and say: "relative to a rotating frame of Neptune's average orbital period and semi-major axis"?
 
See: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resonant_trans-Neptunian_object
 
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« Last Edit: 01/29/09 at 02:55:35 by kheider »  
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frankuitaalst
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Re: Tony, you're on Wikipedia :-)
Reply #1 - 01/31/09 at 13:22:38
 
Nice picture Kevin !  
As Orcus is a Plutino with a similar orbit as Pluto itself I had the idea to represent them both in the same animation , also in rotating frame to Neptune .  
Animation hereunder was run for 41 frames each having 3*164.8 years ( 3 times Neptunes orbital period) .  
Pluto is in grey , Orcus in red .  
The orbits look really very similar , but seem to be in counterphase ...
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OrcusandPlutoRotatingFrame.gif
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Re: Tony, you're on Wikipedia :-)
Reply #2 - 01/31/09 at 13:47:03
 
That'a really neat animation.  It also illustrates the near 2:1 resonance with Uranus.  Uranus is tracing an oval 2:1 pattern, but it does not librate, indicating it is simply a near resonance.  If you re-time your animation so Uranus doesn't jump as the animation loops, it would be even more obvious.  See my animation here http://www.orbitsimulator.com/gravity/articles/pluto.html for an example.
 
On the wiki page, the quote that says "The motion of Orcus relative to a rotating frame of Neptune's average semi-major axis." isn't quite accurate.  A better phrase might be:
 
"The motion of Orcus in a frame of reference rotating with a period equal to Neptune's orbital period."
 
or
 
"The motion of Orcus in a rotating frame of reference where Neptune is held stationary".
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kheider
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Re: Tony, you're on Wikipedia :-)
Reply #3 - 01/31/09 at 16:50:24
 
Quote from frankuitaalst on 01/31/09 at 13:22:38:
Nice picture Kevin !
As Orcus is a Plutino with a similar orbit as Pluto itself I had the idea to represent them both in the same animation

 
Thank you Frank.
 
I like your animation.  I think it might be a little aggressive for the intro of a more general "Resonant trans-Neptunian object" article since
 
1. You have 2 bodies and the general public is not use to rotating frames.
2. Neptune is not clearly labeled when quickly viewing the thumbnails contained in an article.
3. Uranus has a funny circle. Smiley
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Resonant_trans-Neptunian_object#Known_populations
 
But I thought it would be great for the lead in the Plutino article:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Plutino
 
In your animation, I assume that Pluto has mass and that Orcus is massless?  That is how it is in my gsim file.
 
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frankuitaalst
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Re: Tony, you're on Wikipedia :-)
Reply #4 - 02/01/09 at 00:14:00
 
It's really great to have an editor at home  Grin
I gave Orcus it's estimated mass for this simulation ...
Thanks again .  
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kheider
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Re: Tony, you're on Wikipedia :-)
Reply #5 - 02/01/09 at 23:54:17
 
Quote from frankuitaalst on 02/01/09 at 00:14:00:
It's really great to have an editor at home  Grin
I gave Orcus it's estimated mass for this simulation ...
Thanks again.

 
I added a GravSim picture of the orbit of 2007 OR10 compared to the orbits of Eris and Pluto.  It's not much, but it is a start. Smiley
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_OR10
 
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Plutino 2007JH43 vs. Pluto
Reply #6 - 02/28/09 at 09:15:30
 
Curious as always I've run a simulation of another plutino : 2007JH43.  
Simulation was run in rotating frame to Neptune with a frame period of 3 times Neptunes obital period , just as in the above simulation of Orcus .  
2007JH43 in red , Pluto in grey . Just as above the sim covers 40.000 y  
The Plutinos orbit is amazing as it seems to morph its orbit .  
This is due to the fact its nearly circular orbit is also  librating ...
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2007JH43Anim40000y.gif
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kheider
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Re: Plutino 2007JH43 vs. Pluto
Reply #7 - 02/28/09 at 10:31:44
 
Quote from frankuitaalst on 02/28/09 at 09:15:30:
Curious as always I've run a simulation of another plutino : 2007JH43.
Simulation was run in rotating frame to Neptune with a frame period of 3 times Neptunes obital period , just as in the above simulation of Orcus .
2007JH43 in red , Pluto in grey . Just as above the sim covers 40.000 y
The Plutinos orbit is amazing as it seems to morph its orbit .
This is due to the fact its nearly circular orbit is also  librating ...

 
Wow. 2007 JH43 is an interesting object. Smiley
 
JPL (plutino): http://ssd.jpl.nasa.gov/sbdb.cgi?sstr=2007JH43
MPEC 2009-A63 (2:3): http://www.cfa.harvard.edu/mpec/K09/K09A63.html
Buie (SCATNEAR): http://www.boulder.swri.edu/~buie/kbo/astrom/07JH43.html
 
It is a good thing this object still has only a provisional designation. Smiley It has been observed 29 times over 5 oppositions with a quality code of 3.  With an absolute magnitude of 4.7, this object crudely estimated (assumed albedo 0.09) should be ~500km in diameter.  Place your bets? Plutoid Plutino?
-- Kevin
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Re: Plutino 2007JH43 vs. Pluto
Reply #8 - 02/28/09 at 15:00:54
 
I created a page for Plutino 2007 JH43:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_JH43
 
How does (119951) 2002 KX14 compare?  Does Neptune cause a wobble in it?
Buie lists it as a cubewano: http://www.boulder.swri.edu/~buie/kbo/astrom/119951.html
 
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frankuitaalst
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Re: Plutino 2007JH43 vs. Pluto
Reply #9 - 02/28/09 at 15:16:33
 
Quote from kheider on 02/28/09 at 15:00:54:
I created a page for Plutino 2007 JH43:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2007_JH43
How does (119951) 2002 KX14 compare?  Does Neptune cause a wobble in it?
Buie lists it as a cubewano: http://www.boulder.swri.edu/~buie/kbo/astrom/119951.html

-- Kevin

Thanks for the link . TNO's are really great to simulate . I'll let you know tomorrow about 2002KX14 if I've some time .  
In the meantime I've run 1995DA2 , a known 4:3 resonator with Neptune . Cute orbit . Looks like the rotor of a three lobe pump  
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2002 KX14
Reply #10 - 03/01/09 at 00:43:56
 
2002 KX14 may be called a Plutino in wiki , but integration shows it isn't really in resonance with Neptune as Pluto is .  
Hereunder the evolution of the SMA of both bodies .  
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Sma_2002KX14vsPluto.jpg
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1995DA2 in resonance with Neptune
Reply #11 - 03/01/09 at 01:54:39
 
As mentionned yesterday I've run the 1995DA2 asteroid , known to be in 4:3 resonance with Neptune .  
Each frame covers 4 orbits of Neptune . Due to the 4:3 resonance the orbit of 1995DA2 shows three lobes .
In the meantime we get familiar with the librating features of such orbits in rotating frame.
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1995DA2.gif
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Re: 1995DA2 in resonance with Neptune
Reply #12 - 03/01/09 at 12:39:03
 
I have updated Wiki Resonant trans-Neptunian objects:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/(119951)_2002_KX14  (cut and paste link; not listed as plutino, likely cubewano)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/(15836)_1995_DA2  (cut and paste link; 3:4 resonance)
-- Kevin
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kheider
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(84522) 2002 TC302
Reply #13 - 03/04/09 at 22:43:39
 
I would love to see (84522) 2002 TC302 (2:5 resonance; H=3.8 "Big Dwarf Planet Candidate")
Buie: http://www.boulder.swri.edu/~buie/kbo/astrom/84522.html
JPL: http://ssd.jpl.nasa.gov/sbdb.cgi?sstr=84522
 
-- Kevin
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Re: Tony, you're on Wikipedia :-)
Reply #14 - 03/05/09 at 01:12:50
 
Here's a still image
 
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